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expression of regret at his violation of its privileges, does not feel itself called upon to proceed farther in this matter." The resolution was agreed to, and Mr. Hope being again called in, the Speaker communicated to him the said Resolution.

of this House, be excused from any farther attendance upon this House."

HOUSE OF COMMONS.

Thursday, July 18.

RETAIL OF BEER BILL.] Mr. Brougham, in rising to move the second reading of this bill, begged to premise that he meant to cast no reflections on either of those two large and respectable bodies who con

Mr. Menzies was then called in, and Mr. Speaker communicated to him the proceedings of the House of the said 9th July, in the matter of the complaint of a Letter signed W. Menzies, and addressed to the Editor of "The Courier" news-ceived themselves to be principally interpaper.

Mr. Menzies said, he felt most anxious to assure the House of the profound respect which he entertained, and always had entertained, for their privileges. But he would shortly state the circumstances which had called forth the writing now before them. A report of a speech made in that House had reached him. In that report he found a severe attack upon his conduct. He found that gross injustice was done to his motives by a false statement of his professional proceedings. If this false statement had originated with the newspapers, he considered it indispensable for him to correct it. If, on the other hand, it had really been made in that House, he felt sure that it had been made in consequence of false information. He had therefore applied by letter to the hon. gentleman for an explanation of the fact, whether the statement as set forth in the newspapers was correct. To this application he had received an answer, that the hon. gentleman was not responsible for any reports in the newspapers, but that what he had said was fully supported by the statement in his (Mr. M.'s) own letter. Now, as that statement did not support the reports in the newspapers, he understood this to be evidence that the reports were false. If he had understood it otherwise, he would not have applied the term false to the statement of the hon. gentleman. He had written the paragraph now complained of,

under the impression that what Mr. Abercomby had said coincided not with the statements in the newspapers. Considering the statements in the newspapers false and calumnious, he could not retract a word of what he had applied to them; but he solemnly declared that he had not had the slightest idea that what he was doing was a violation of the privileges of that House.

Ordered, "That Mr. Menzies, having explained his conduct to the satisfaction

ested in opposing it. The hon. and learned gentleman having proceeded to show that within a very few years the population of this country had increased from ten to fifteen millions, while the consumption of beer had considerably decreased, observed that several causes might be assigned for this fact. He was not one of those who suspected the brewers of having adulterated their beer by all those drugs which they were, he believed, with great exaggerations, accused of using; but one of those causes, he certainly, in common with the poor man, did believe to exist, and did absolutely find. It was not that he tasted the deleterious coculus Indicus, or quassia, or nux vomica, but it was the tax, the cruel tax, which he found in the pot. It was a tax which bore with peculiar hardship on the poor, and very slightly on the rich; for the malt duty was 20s. the quarter; besides another duty of 10s. the barrel on strong beer. Now, reckoning three barrels to the quarter-the poor man had to pay a duty of 30s. per quarter. This was the unjust proportion in which the poor man had to pay for his beer. Out of every 50s. paid for that beer, 30s. was paid by the poor man who purchased it at the common retail price. The gentleman of 20,000l. a year paid 20s. a quarter for his share of the 50s. total duty. The rich man, who in the exercise of a generous hospitality brewed beer for his own servants and those of his neighbours, paid only 20s. where 50s. were paid in duties. This alone would furnish him (Mr. B.) with a sufficient ground for calling on parliament to protect his effort to obtain for the poor man a better article at a cheaper rate. He had now to come to closer quarters with the two bodies of men of whom he had spoken-the victuallers and the brewers. And first as to small beer. The law at present permitted men to vend that article without a license. As to this small beer, unquestionably no liquor was ever better named; but if there

was another word in the language more expressive of littleness and poverty than "small," as applied to this composition, he would use it. It was not of this that he was speaking, however, but of strong beer. Gin-drinking was that peculiar vice in the character of our artisans which he wished to put down. As to selling strong beer, an excise license and a magistrate's license were required for it, and it could not be sold in barrels containing less than five gallons each. If the excise licenses were done away with, and the magistrates were enabled to grant their licenses for the sale of strong beer to whom they chose, there would be but little difference between that course and the one which he should propose to night, except, indeed, that still the poor man would have to pay too dear for his beer. But one great evil would be prevented. Several of our laws were directed against tippling, but with admiral inconsistency they sent the poor man to the tipplinghouse before he could get his pot of liquor. He was ready to concede to his hon. friend, that however contrary to the principle of a free trade it might be for the legislature to grant monopolies, vet, as long as the law under which those monopolies were authorized, was in force, the parties to the monopolies had vested rights in them. But this was not the case with the brewers; for he totally denied that the law had given them any such monopoly, nor could he see how the extension of the magistrates' licenses could induce or encourage the vice of tippling. The brewers were, for the most part, the landlords of the public-houses; and of late, so far had they proceeded, step by step, in acquiring the possession of this species of property, that an instance was adduced the other day of there being in one parish 49 public-houses, only one of which was not their property. At present, the only competition was amongst the brewers themselves. A most insufficient competition this for the public advantage! And though the argument did not apply quite so strongly to London, where there were many and large capitalists, he could point out a district in the country where there was only one brewer. The consequence of all this was, that these brewers had made their monopoly complete by buying up all the property of a particular description which they could lay their hands on, so as to command the funnel by which the liquor was conveyed to the

mouth of the public. The brewers had found it advantageous gradually to reduce the quantity of malt and hops in their beer, until at length it was no longer that liquor of which Boniface once declared, that he could eat, drink, and sleep upon, and which was also clothing to him. The consequence of passing this bill would be, that a better and cheaper beer would be brewed; and, what was incalculably the more important consideration, instead of a man being obliged to go himself to the tippling-house, and being there perhaps tempted to drink-or sending his daughter or female servant, or his wife thither-he would go to a shop for it, where no bad example would prevail to taint either his own morals or those of his family, to the. great injury of the poorer classes of society. Then, too, the good old wholesome English beer would once more flow in the country, and become a competitor (and he ventured to say, that on any fair terms it would be a triumphant competitor) with that which was a liquor pernicious alike to the health and the morals of a large proportion of the community. He concluded by moving, that the bill be read a second time.

Mr. F. Buxton expressed his concurrence in all the early and general observations of the hon. member regarding the effect of taxation upon the poor. He contended that this bill would ruin not less than 50,000 persons, and interfere with thirty millions of property; but if it were clear of all other objections, the lateness at which it was brought forward ought to ensure its rejection. He begged the House to separate the case and conduct of the brewers from that of the publicans; for the latter at least were not monopolists, and had not, as had been said, overcharged the trade with capital. As to the London brewers, he was prepared to show that they had not sold any such beer, in quality, composition or strength, as warranted the remarks of the hon. gentleman. After stating the class of persons of whom pub. licans were generally composed; namely, servants who had made savings out of their wages-he went on to argue from his own knowledge, that the most important part of the business of a victualler was not the beer he sold in his house, but that which he sent out to customers in the neighbourhood. If chandlers and barbers, and other small shopkeepers, were allowed to sell beer, the consequence would be, that a most respectable, industrious, and numerous de

ed, however, that the publicans had nothing like a vested interest in the sale of beer, and that their case was not in any respect to be likened to that of the public creditor. He saw no material objection to a measure, if it could be devised, by which other persons besides licensed publicans might be allowed to sell beer of some. what better quality than that now called small beer. It seemed to him that there could be no true ground for asserting, that all the publicans in the kingdom would be ruined by the bill upon the table. In a future session, he thought some plan of this sort might be devised by which the revenue might be augmented, and the growth of barley increased, without material injury to the licensed victuallers. The best mode of encouraging the consumption of beer by the people in general ought to be steadily kept in view by the legislature. No person who had lived so long as he had but must perceive that a greater degree of sobriety prevailed amongst the lower classes now than was formerly the case. This was occasioned by a diminution of the quantity of spirits that used to be drank; and to that might be attributed the very great improvement which was known to have taken place in the average duration of the lives of the lower orders. He implored the chancellor of the exchequer to ascertain, during the recess, whether, consistently with the protection of the revenue, and even its im provement, and without violating the rights of the publicans and others who embarked their capital in the beer trade, he could not devise some plan to enable families who did not wish to frequent public houses to procure a better article than small beer, from indifferent persons.

scription of persons would be utterly annihilated. The existing law was established as long since as the reign of Edward 6th, and until very lately he had had a lease of a public house in his possession, granted by a distinguished citizen, and a member of the House-no other than Praise-GodBare-Bones, which house was kept by a victualler at this moment. From the time of Praise-God-Bare-Bones to the present, it had retained its license. The hon. gentleman had talked largely of the increase of the growth of barley, and of the improvement of the revenue which this bill would occasion; but he knew no law by which a man could be deprived of his property and his rights, without a full and fair equivalent. If the argument of public good and public convenience were to prevail in this instance, he saw no reason why it should not be extended to the national debt. This was the first step towards an attack upon private property, and no man could tell which would be the last. He proceeded, on the contrary, to insist that the change in the law would be ruinous to the public morals, detrimental to the revenue, and injurious even to the growers of barley. If the bill were passed, the control which the revenue had over public houses would be destroyed. Obscure persons, without character and without money, would commence selling beer in private places; persons who would not fear fines, which they could not pay, or dread infamy which could scarcely make them more degraded. The practice which was now sought to be established with respect to beer, prevailed in the year 1742. With respect to the sale of spirits at that period, so little were public morals or even public decency regarded, that venders of spirits in the streets of London put up boards, stating, in large letters, that persons might get drunk for one penny, dead drunk for twopence, and be allowed straw for nothing. It was not for his hon. friend, who had, within a week, pronounced an invective against bills passed on the 10th of July who said they were open to the suspicion of injustice-to bring for-gle barrel, which would, like the small ward a measure affecting so great a portion of society, and embracing so many important consequences.

Mr. Alderman Wood contended, that the bill would be injurious to a large class of persons without a corresponding good to the public. The great quantity of beer which a publican was enabled to draw, made the beverage he supplied superior to that which would be afforded by a chandler, who would keep perhaps a sin

beer now sold in the same way, be sour in summer and vapid in winter. In many parts of London good beer was now to be Mr. Huskisson thought it injudicious at had at 4d. a quart, of which 1d. was duty. this period of the session, to legislate upon The vested rights of parties were surely to private property, when the parties inter- be regarded. Houses were taken and ested could not be duly heard. He there-built on the faith of the existing law, and fore recommended that the bill should be many widows and orphans would be ruined withdrawn for the present. He contend-by the violation of it. There was, in point

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The Chancellor of the Exchequer said, that ministers were not inimical to the principle on which the measure proceeded. On the contrary, the subject had been under the consideration of the Treasury, and means, he believed, had been devised to enable the public to brew a middle sort of beer, of a proper strength and body, and at a proportionate duty. The bill was withdrawn.

CANADA GOVERNMENT AND TRADE BILL.] On the order of the day for recommitting this bill,

of fact, a great competition in beer; for it was obviously the interest of the brewers to supply the public houses with an article that would please their consumers. Mr. Brougham said, that on the failure of a principal clause in the Licensing bill, he had thought it his duty to introduce the present measure; and finding so much interest and prejudice working against it, he had thought it necessary to persevere to the present stage. He should now consent to postpone the measure to the next session. He implored the chancellor of the exchequer to turn his attention to some arrangement with respect to the beer duty, so as to afford a middle kind of beer between that which paid the 10s. and that which paid the 2s. duty. By the 43rd of the king, there was no medium. There was, however, no obstacle to private brewing. People generally had no notion how savingly private brewing could be carried on. They saved 30s. per barrel, and their proportion of the licensing duty, which produced 600,000l. a year. The first difficulty was the cost of the apparatus; but 31, or 41. would purchase brewing utensils sufficient for the poor and even for the rich man. If one person, could not purchase the whole three or four might club their mites and brew in each other's houses, taking care (for there the exchequer stepped in) not to sell the beer to one another, but to share the produce of their common property. He recommended gentlemen to make the gift of this apparatus one of their bounties to the people in their neighbourhood. The only other obstacle was the supposed difficulty in the operation of brewing. There was a small pamphlet which gave all the instructions necessary on this subject it was Mr. Cobbett's Sermon on brewing. He had never known a person who had read it, who was not able to compete with the most skilful brewer. Mean time, he would recommend that those who felt an interest in the bill, should petition for it. If half the activity was shown by those who had an interest in promoting the bill that was shown by those who had an interest in opposing it, the table would be covered with the prayers of hundreds of thousands of petitioners. For himself, he should be found in his place next session, ready to assist the people in obtaining one of the most important boons, as regarded their wealth, and health, and morals, that was ever granted by a legislature to a people. He should now withdraw the bill.

Mr. Wilmot in moving that the Speaker do leave the chair, said, that the matter of the bill before them night be brought under three heads: the first part went to alter the constitution of the provinces of Canada, which had been established by the act of 1791; the second, to apply to Canada the principles of an extension of free trade, which had been sanctioned by the bills of his right hon. friend; the third and last, to settle the appropriation of duties between the two provinces of Upper and Lower Canada. The last of these in order he should consider first; because it was the anomalous position of the provinces in reference to these duties, that had led to the necessity of remedial measures. When the French province of Canada was conquered by the British arms, the criminal law of England was introduced into the conquered country, and the civil law of France was suffered to remain, modified by a proclamation issued in 1763, and by various ordinances subsequently made. The alterations introduced into the French law by these ordinances, led to anomalies in the law, which were remedied by the Canada act of 1774, which restored the French civil law to the province. From 1774 to 1791, the government of the province had been carried on by a governor and a numerous executive council, who had not the power of local taxation, the taxes being imposed by the parliament of Great Britain. Previously to 1791, after the American war, the upper part of the provinces which had been comprehended under the general name of Canada, but which was not inhabited, was colonized by American loyalists. In 1791, the Quebec act was passed, the debates on which took place amidst circumstances which were interesting to every Englishman who studied the history of his country, as they produced the difference between two great, men, VOL. VII. 5 Q

Mr. Fox and Mr. Burke. The colony | ject, which took place in that House in was by act divided into two provinces, April, 1791, in which Mr. Fox declared Upper and Lower Canada. This division was objected to by Mr. Fox, and it was defended on the ground that the inhabitants of the upper part of Canada were as nine to one Englishmen, and that it would be unjust to subject them to the same law as the lower province. At the same time, when separate provinces were erected, an arrangement was made respecting the duties levied in the port of Quebec, which was the common inlet to both provinces. The duties upon imports into Upper Canada did not amount to more than one-eighth of the duties on imports into Lower Canada; and it was therefore considered that the province of Upper Canada was not entitled to more than one'eighth of the revenue. This arrangement continued up to 1797. From that period to the year 1817, the principle of examination by Custom-house officers was adopted, in order to ascertain the proportion of revenue which Upper Canada was entitled to receive; but this practice was found so extremely inconvenient, that it was soon abandoned, and a fifth portion of the duties was assigned to Upper Canada, for a period of two years. At the end of that period commissioners were appointed to regulate the proportion of revenue to be assigned to each of these provinces; but, notwithstanding all the diligence of those commissioners, it was found impossible to come to a fair adjustment of the claims of the two colonies. The consequence was, that Upper Canada had been deprived of her fair proportion of revenue; and it was one of the objects of this bill to remedy this grievance by supplying the means of arbitration. When it appeared to be the deliberate opinion of the commissioners of Lower Canada, that they could arrive at no principle of adjustment, which was likely to be satisfactory to both colonies, it was natural for the government of this country to consider whether some measures might not be adopted, which, by uniting the two provinces, and incorporating their legislatures, might consolidate the interests of the two colonies. Such a measure was suggested, not less by general principles of expediency, than by the pressing necessity arising out of the difficulty of adjusting the claims of the two colonies. He begged leave to refer to a report of a debate on this sub

his approbation of the policy of uniting the two provinces of Upper and Lower Canada. Mr. Pitt in his reply to Mr. Fox on that occasion, stated, that if the assembly were not properly constituted, it was subject to revision, and that there was nothing to hinder the parliament of Great Britain from correcting any thing which might appear to want correction. He agreed in the abstract principles of Mr. Fox, but thought that they could not conveniently be carried into effect at that period. The only object of the present measure was, to bring the two colonies into a closer union, by incorporating the two legislatures, so that the English language, and the spirit of the English constitution might be more completely diffused among all classes of their population. No rights or privileges now enjoyed by any persons, in either of the provinces, would be, in the slightest degree, affected by the present measure. There was a clause in the bill which gave the representatives of the executive government a right to speak in the House of assembly. There was another clause establishing a qualification for the persons elected, a provision which had been omitted in the first act. The sum fixed upon as a qualification was, however, such as would in no degree diminish the general competition for such a situationwhich ought to exist among a free people. There were two declaratory clauses, relating to the clergy and the feudal tenures, the object of which was to abolish a system of property, so utterly repugnant to every sound principle of litical economy. In the clauses relating to trade, the same policy which had been pursued in the bill regulating the trade of the West India colonies had been applied to the inland trade of the Canadas. A drawback was allowed on rum imported from the West Indies, when exported again from the Canadas, to which he apprehended no objection would be made. An objection had been made to this measure on the ground that the feelings and opinions of the people had not been consulted; but he could assure the House that every means had been taken to procure the best information on this subject, that the measure was deemed to be decidedly beneficial to both provinces, and that it had received the complete sanction of those who, from their position and ex

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